GIBSON ES-335 ES-345 ES-355
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Oddities and One Offs

August 31st, 2020 • Uncategorized10 Comments »

I have to say that my favorite part of the vintage guitar business is finding rare or one of a kind ES guitars (or having them find me). I’ve done this post before showcasing the “greenburst” 335, a lefty block neck blonde 335 and a 355 with pointy cutaways. Gibson has always been accommodating to the needs and wishes of musicians and was happy to make something out of the ordinary for you (for a price, of course). It was often the owners name inlaid in the fingerboard or an alternative electronics setup (think Varitone in a 335). Interestingly, these things often diminish the value over a bone stock version. Who wants to play a guitar with somebody else’s name writ large across the fingerboard. Short of changing your name, there isn’t a good fix for this. But then there are one of a kinds that are simply colors or a configuration that isn’t offered in the catalogue. I’ve had a few of these recently and this is a good time to write another post about these wonderful oddities.

A cherryburst 335 is neither rare nor particularly exciting unless it’s a dot neck. This finish was common starting in 1965 but a cherryburst dot neck? Unheard of. This is the only one (as far as I know)

The cherryburst 1961 dot neck was offered to me recently (and I bought it). When I saw the photos, my first thought was “oh, another cherryburst 65…” I don’t particularly like this finish and I was ready to dismiss it until I noticed the dots. This finish was in the Gibson lineup as early as the 1940’s but not for a 335. That didn’t happen until 1965. This is the only cherryburst dot neck I’ve ever seen. Beyond that, it was also the cleanest dot neck I’ve ever seen. I rarely use the term “mint” but this one was all of that. There’s a very lucky, very happy collector out there who owns the only one of these known.

White ES guitars have never been common. Keith Richards has the one he calls “Dwight”. His is a 345. This is a 1965 wide nut ES-355.

I was really skeptical when I first saw this white 355 many years ago. But when I owned it years ago, I didn’t know much about these guitars and I sold it to the next owner as “ambiguous”. It was the paint on the neck binding that threw me off. Now I know that Gibson usually painted white guitars that way (look at any LP/SG Custom) and it’s definitely a factory white finish. They became a little more common by 1969 and into the 70’s but a mid 60’s white one is pretty rare. The white tends to turn yellow because the clear lacquer that goes over the paint tends to turn yellow over time. You don’t notice it so much on a sunburst or even a red guitar but on a white one, it really shows up.

Whenever I encounter a rare variant, I try to get hold of the ledger page for that serial number to see if there’s a note about it being a special order. Sometimes, there’s nothing. Sometimes it’s noted and sometimes, the serial number is left blank in the book. I’d say it’s 50-50. Having the page is a real plus but not having it doesn’t necessarily diminish its authenticity. Of the 5 black 59 ES-345’s, only three of them are noted in the logs but the others are very clearly original. This 1963 black ES-345 is one that we got lucky on. I don’t own this one but it’s the only black 63 I know of. Black is rare but has always been a popular color so there are a fair number of them around each year. I know of perhaps twelve of them from 59 to 64. Interestingly, most are 345’s. I’m not sure why. A black 335 seems to be incredibly rare until the late 60’s and even then you can count them on one hand.

Sometimes you get lucky. I was sent a photo of a black 63 ES-345 by a friend of the original owner who special ordered it. And there it was, 115826 plain as day in the 63 log book.

And here it is. I don’t own it but i’ve been after it for at least four years now. You’ll know if I get it.

Refinishes

August 24th, 2020 • Uncategorized5 Comments »

Sometimes a refinish is really obvious like when the guitar is finished in a non Gibson color. This Candy Apple Red 62 dot neck is one of the best sounding ones I’ve ever owned. Certainly in the top 20 if not the top 10. Looked pretty cool too.

It’s always been a bit of a mystery to me why a professionally refinished guitar is worth so much less than a factory original. Vintage and antique cars get repainted all the time and the prices don’t drop like a stone. Antique furniture, however, follows the vintage guitar rule: Don’t mess with the finish. A refinish knocks anywhere from 40-50% off the value. That’s a lot considering the guitar with a pro refinish is usually every bit as playable and attractive as it’s original counterpart.

I could go on about how a factory refinish isn’t as much of a decrease in value as an aftermarket refinish even though the work can be superior. I could also talk about Fender’s penchant for putting custom color finishes over sunbursts (and still be considered original). Or the Selmer Fiesta reds being considered by many to be refinished even though they were never sold with any other finish. Or put differently-it’s OK if Fender paints Fiesta over sunburst but not OK if Selmer does it. There’s a clear lack of logic to the vintage guitar rule book and I’m not one to rock the boat. I simply accept the rules and grumble about them occasionally (like now).

What I really want to talk about are refinished and oversprayed ES models. The good news is that folks didn’t feel compelled to refinish these guitars as often as the Fender owners did back in the day. It could be because the Fender finishes tended to chip and wear more easily than the Gibson finishes. It could also be the relative ease of stripping an unbound solid block of wood over a laminated, arched and bound hollow or semi hollow box. So, 335’s and the like simply don’t get refinished all that often but I’ve certainly run across my share. Some done brilliantly, some, well, not so brilliantly. The amateur jobs are pretty obvious but a pro job often requires an experienced eye.

The black light is a useful tool but it has its limitations but it’s a great place to start. The entire guitar should glow evenly under blacklight. If any areas look different, you can bet they were touched up for one reason or another. If the entire guitar black lights consistently, then it’s not so easy. A brand new refinish won’t glow much but an older one will look identical to an original finish under black light if the entire instrument was done. So ends the usefulness of the black light. So, how do I know if the finish is original or not if the black light fails me? Lots of ways.

I start with looking in the nooks and crannies. It is really hard to remove the finish from the deep corners of a pickup rout-especially on a dyed finish like Gibson’s red. The other place to look for remnants of the original finish is in the holes for the pots-folks simply forget to remove it. More obvious is to look inside the f-holes. There is never color in there. I’ve seen clear lacquer from the factory in there on very rare occasions when the guitar has the “2” designation on the back of the headstock-which, by the way, doesn’t mean factory second. It means it went back to the spray booth a second time. In general, any paint or clear lacquer inside the body is a bad sign.

Because it is very difficult to chemically strip a 335, you have to sand. And no matter how carefully you sand, you are going to take some wood off with the finish. Chemical strippers will melt the bindings and they won’t get the red dye out of the wood as it sinks in too deeply. You might get away with a chemical strip of a sunburst but not a red. So, let’s assume the finish is black and it looks really good. They taped off the f-holes and sprayed over the pickup routs and painted over the original color from the all the holes. I usually take a scraper and remove a little finish from inside the pickup rout to see if there is another color underneath. Again, easier on a red one than on a sunburst. But there is an almost foolproof way to tell if a 335, 345 or 355 has been refinished.

The original finish is sprayed on over the bindings and the bindings are then scraped clean of any paint. The bindings end up “lower” than the rim of the guitar or put differently, the rim will be “proud” of the binding. Run your fingernail from the body binding to the rim of the guitar. If its perfectly smooth, the guitar has been sanded and refinished. Period. End of thought. There are no exceptions. Every ES guitar that’s passed through my hands has had the ridge unless it’s been refinished. Do that test first and you won’t get fooled again. Next, we’ll look at oversprays. That’s when the finish is still original but someone has gone and sprayed a new coat of clear over it.

This super rare white ’65 ES-355 had me concerned until I was able to inspect it in hand. The usual photos simply don’t show enough detail to see the ridge I talk about in the post. You can see it here. There wasn’t a trace of any other color anywhere, it black lighted perfectly but I wasn’t going to be convinced until I felt the ridge between binding and rim.

Parts Timeline #3: Bridges

July 23rd, 2020 • ES 335, ES 345, ES 3555 Comments »

The top ABR-1 is a low profile version from a 58 ES-335. It’s bent as are most of them. They simply couldn’t handle the downward pressure from a set of 12’s with a wound G string. They were gone by the end of the year replaced with what you see at the bottom-the no wire full height ABR-1

If you take the time to learn all of the “parts timelines” that I am posting, you should be able to date any ES 335, 345 or 355 built between 1958 and 1969. After that, I’m not your guy. I get dozens of e-mails asking me to authenticate, date or appraise these guitars every week and I do my best to answer them all. The problem is that all of my knowledge is based on observation. Yes, I read everything on the internet…guitarhq site-excellent and informative with a few small errors and one glaring one about 335’s and I read Adrian Ingraham’s book-not so excellent. I took what I could from them but going through around 600 guitars over the past 15 years or so has taught me more than any book. And, by the way, I was flattered to have been asked by Tony Bacon to consult with him on the history section of his 335 book.

The ABR-1 bridge first showed up in 1953 when the first Les Paul Custom was released. It hasn’t changed much over the years although it was discontinued for a while and brought back. It was a good design from day one, allowing the player to intonate each string individually, although it was limited in that you couldn’t adjust the height of each string individually. Still works pretty well though. The ABR-1 is not without its issues and some of them were addressed by Gibson and some were not. Let’s start in 1958 since that’s when the first 335’s were issued. The neck angle on the 335 was, for reasons unknown, very shallow and required a lower profile ABR-1 to allow the action to be low enough. Good enough solution to a problem which shouldn’t have existed in the first place. It was a kind of “don’t raise the bridge, lower the river” solution. The ABR-1 was made of cheap metal that fatigued and bent easily. 90% of vintage ABR-1’s have some measure of sag in the middle. The low profile ABR-1 was much worse. Most of them simply broke in half. Remember, nobody was using light gauge strings back in the 50’s. 335’s shipped with 12’s and 13’s were common. All sets had wrapped G strings. So, the stress on the bridge was considerable and they sagged.

By late 58, enough owners complained and Gibson started issuing shaved full height bridges to replace the sagging low profile ones. At around the same time, they changed the neck angle to allow for a full height bridge. End of problem. But there were other problems. The early ABR-1 had nothing to hold the saddle in place but the string pressure. Imagine you’re playing a gig in a dark bar, on a dark stage. You break the E string and the saddle flies off. You probably don’t have to imagine too hard. It’s happened to most of us. It’s a little like losing a contact lens. You’re down on your knees in the middle of a gig trying to find the missing saddle. You can’t find it and you play the rest of the gig with 5 strings. The solution was simple, if a little inelegant. In early 1963 (could be late 62-it’s hard to pin down the date because so many have been changed) Gibson added a retaining wire to keep the saddles in place. It’s a pain to remove and a pain to reinstall if you need to, but it works. There have been ABR-1 copies that have saddles that stay in place without a wire and Gibson had one called the Nashville bridge but that’s a different post.

At some point during 1962, they switched from metal saddles to nylon. I think the reason for this was to make the strings slide more easily across the saddles when using the then popular Bigsby. They finally got around to beefing up the bridge to lessen the effect of the pressure exerted by the strings. This occurred in 1965 and, unless you have an older one and a newer one side by side, you probably won’t notice the slightly heavier design. At about the same time they added the patent number to the bottom of the unit and made the company name and the manufacturer’s mark much smaller. That maker’s mark would disappear by the late 60’s (useful for dating).

Timeline:

58: Low profile metal saddles. No wire, nickel

Late 58-early 63: Full height (some shaved in late 58), no wire, metal saddles, nickel

Late 62-early 63: Full height, no wire, nylon saddles (rare), nickel

63-early 65: Full height, wire retainer, nylon saddles, nickel

65-69: Full height, wire, nylon saddles, patent number w/makers mark. Chrome. Makers mark disappears around 69.

Gold bridges follow similar timeline with some small variation in dates.

One more odd characteristic to note. In ’65, there were 4 different versions of ABR-1 used on 335’s. There was the nickel one with Gibson in big letters on the back in nickel. The same one in chrome and the one with the patent number in both nickel (rare) and chrome. All had nylon saddles and wire retainers. The early nickel one was gone by the Spring and a few of the patent number nickel ones showed up during that period. By around May, Gibson had used up most of the nickel parts and was using chrome. There are plenty of guitars with some nickel and some chrome parts in 1965. It’s pretty easy to tell the difference once the nickel starts to tarnish but when brand new, they look pretty similar to most folks. Here’s a tip if you aren’t sure. Chrome looks blue. Nickel looks green. It’s subtle.

Covering a lot of ground with this photo. Top is patent number with the makers mark (off to the right). Below that is pat # without it in chrome. Early nickel below that -note the difference between chrome and nickel. Bottom shows the retaining wire.

There are no Rules

July 13th, 2020 • Uncategorized6 Comments »

This ES-355 has a 66 serial number but it has a wide-nearly 1 11/16″ nut. It could be that it was a leftover from 65 as 355’s were pretty low volume sellers. No rules.

I try very hard to find consistency when discussing Gibsons from the so-called “Golden Era”. Certain rules and features seem to apply most of the time…PAFs until 62, then mixed PAFs and patents from 62-64, wide nut until mid 65, stop tails until early 65 and a whole lot of other features that follow a fairly predictable timeline. Except when they don’t.

One of the most desirable features of 58- early 65 ES models is the wide nut. We call it 1 11/16″ but it varies from just over 1 5/8″ to just over 1 11/16″ but all of them are wider than the 1 9/16″ nut that was introduced in mid 65 and has rendered mid 65’s to 1981 models less desirable to many players and that’s a really big deal. Imagine if 68’s had the wide nut (it’s a common misconception that they do). They would be the most desirable year post 64 for sure. Yes, 68’s had the trapeze and often had t-tops but those things can be changed. But you can’t make a narrow neck into a wide one without some very expensive (and invasive) surgery. Then a rule breaker shows up.

It is pretty commonly known that models like Byrdlands, L-5’s, Kessels and 355’s sold in fairly low numbers. Even with the low volume, they would generally make a “rack” of the same model (usually 35 guitars) all at once and then sit on the unfinished guitars until they had an order to fill. That’s why you sometimes see patent number pickups in a 61 guitar or some other earlier feature in a guitar with a later serial number. The guitars were simply built in one year and sold in the next year (or later). That’s how we end up with 1960 guitars with 1958 factory order numbers for example. But there are no FON’s after 61, so we have only the features to go by when we are trying to figure out what year the guitar was built (or at least started).

I recently purchased a 1966 ES-355 with a wide nut-just under 1 11/16″. It is the second 66 ES-355 I’ve encountered with that feature. That probably means that the guitar was built in early 65 (or at least the neck was carved then) and sat somewhere until an order came in some time in 66. I’m sure that a bunch of narrow nut 355’s went out in 65 and early 66 because I’ve seen plenty of them. So why did this one sit? Maybe it had a small flaw or maybe it was at the back of the pile and more newly made ones were headed out the door first. Without a time machine, it’s hard to know. The larger point is that all the rules I write about get broken time and time again and it isn’t always possible to come up with a reason. You could easily ask “was it re-necked later with a custom ordered neck?” Or maybe it was simply a custom order that specified a particular nut width. I know it wasn’t re-necked (it’s pretty easy to tell) but I suppose it could have been a custom order. Again, where did I leave the keys to the time machine.

I’ve had a similar experience with another 66. This was a 345 with honest to god Mickey Mouse ears. Left over early 60’s body? Maybe. Probably. The rule is that MM ears were gone by late 63 when they redid the jigs for making ES 335, 345 and 355 bodies. But this 345 and at least two others I’ve seen made their way out the door in 1966. So, no rule is a hard and fast rule and no feature is 100% consistent over the era of 1958 to 1969. After 1969, you’re on your own-I just don’t see enough of them to know much. Let me know if you have an oddball like these. It gives me something to write about.

A 66 should not have Mickey Mouse ear cutaways. And yet, this one does and at least two others I’ve seen do as well. There is a fair amount of inconsistency in the shape of the cutaways from 66 to 67 (pointy ear, “fox ear”, etc) but Mickeys? No. Great player too, by the way, although I’m sure it had nothing to do with the ears. If I recall, this one had early patent numbers which might have had something to do with it.

Pandemic Buying

June 24th, 2020 • Uncategorized5 Comments »

Pandemic shmandemic. High end is selling. The low end is selling and in between is selling. This 60 burst went to Texas not too long ago. I’ve got another if you’re looking.

I thought that the pandemic was going to affect he vintage guitar market and I was right. But I thought the market would slow down and I was wrong. It hasn’t. I thought it might tank but I was afraid to say that (not that I have the clout to tank the guitar market-I don’t). What I didn’t think would happen was that folks would be buying guitars like there was no tomorrow (and maybe there is no tomorrow which would explain it). I am selling nearly twice as many guitars now as I was selling before the pandemic and social distancing began. I can’t say with any certainty why this is happening but I can certainly tell you what I see and what I think might be going on.

First, it’s everywhere, not just the USA. In the past two months I’ve sold guitars to folks in Taiwan, Ireland, England, Israel, Japan and Canada. So, what is selling? Well, everything. High end stuff is selling. Player grade stuff is selling, stuff I’ve had in my shop for two years or more is selling. Guitars that aren’t terribly popular are selling. I sold a Guild Thunderbird, an Epiphone Wilshire, an ES-175, a J-160E, a Gretsch 6120 along with the usual assortment of 335’s and 345’s ad 355’s. I even sold my personal Partscaster which I hardly ever played. But the usual high end stuff is selling too-a couple of 59 ES-345’s, a refinished 60 burst, a 58 335 and a 59 335. Tweed amps are going. Two Bassmans, a Super and a Deluxe since this thing began. I lowered some prices in anticipation of a weakened market but it hasn’t happened. Anybody know why?

I have theories. The most obvious is sheer boredom. Staying home, especially if you live in an apartment (which I don’t) must be suffocating. Nothing brightens up a dull existence like a “new” guitar. I get at least a hundred a year and it still feels like Christmas morning every time one arrives. Of course, you’re going to drive your family up the wall if you’re using all that spare time to practice your scales and learn some new licks and aren’t you all ready to kill each other as it is? No? OK. But there’s a limit to how much boredom can drive the market. You need money to feed the vintage habit and with so many folks out of work, you might think this is a bad time to be buying and selling guitars. Apparently not. That leads me to another theory. It’s the “I might die tomorrow, so I should get the things that will really make me happy now” theory. I like this theory because it transcends money and boredom. It also has no end. Just because a 59 335 makes you happy today doesn’t mean a 54 Telecaster won’t make you even happier tomorrow. And then there’s always the day after tomorrow to think about. Or maybe you just want to park your money somewhere other than the stock market. Let’s consider that.

The stock market has taken a hit and it is coming back strongly but with the long term economic effects of the pandemic still in the theoretical realm, who knows how long any perceived recovery is going to last. How long before the airline, entertainment, hospitality and restaurant industries will get back to something approaching normal? Opening states too early is showing some bad, bad results. See you in September? I think not. This thing is here until they can vaccinate about a zillion people. So, where do you put your money once you’ve lost faith in the stock market? Gold is way up so you’ve probably missed the boat on that one. Vintage automobiles? There’s no place to go (there’s a pandemic going on or haven’t you noticed?) and looking at your 54 MG in the garage has a limited appeal. Vintage guitars? At least you can sit and play your vintage guitar while it appreciates (or not) even if the wife and kids are ready to kill you for spending hours on end trying to be Jimmy Page in that little shoe box of an apartment you’re stuck in. How about real estate? Get a house with an outbuilding so you can play your guitar without raising the homicide rate in your town. Yeah. That’s the ticket.

Amps are flying out the door as well. I started this pandemic with 7 tweed Bassmans. I’m down to 5 (woe is me).

Parts Timeline #2: Tuners

June 13th, 2020 • ES 335, ES 345, ES 3556 Comments »

PAT APPLD next to later patent number Kluson tuners. The PAT APPLD had a different plastic tip that was less likely to deteriorate. By 59, they were all patent number

It’s worth keeping track of what changes occurred in the timeline of ES guitars and when they occurred especially when you’re trying to date these guitars. As I’ve said about a zillion times before, changes didn’t happen on January 1 of a given year. They happened when they needed to happen and the changes were usually gradual, taking place over the course of weeks or months. It was never PAFs of December 31 and patent numbers on January 1. The pickup timeline is full of overlaps and erroneous “conventional wisdom”. The tuner timeline is a little easier to document but there are still some commonly held beliefs that need to be addressed.

Let’ start with 335’s. It’s pretty simple, really. Klusons from day one and that never changed. In 1981, they went to Grovers but we don’t really deal with “new” guitars from the 80’s (I can’t believe 1980 was 40 years ago). Klusons, while always the tuner of choice on a 355, went through all sorts of changes in the 50’s from single lines with no hole for the tuner key shaft to no lines with that hole to single lines with the hole which is where we begin in 1958. Wait a second. What does single line mean? You can’t imagine how often I get asked this. It’s simple. The words “Kluson Deluxe” engraved on the back of the housing are on a single line down the middle of the housing. Double line would have the same words engraved on two vertical lines. Then there single ring and double ring. This refers to the tuning key tips. Single ring had one “ring” a circular element at the inside end of the tuner top. Double ring tuners had 2 rings. The photos make it clear if my description doesn’t.

Let’s kill two birds here. Big oil hole (1958-early 60) on the left with a single ring tip. On the right, small hole with a shrunken double ring tip. Double ring tips started in mid 60 or so.

1958-1960 (mid year): Single line single ring nickel Klusons. 1960-late 1964: Single line, double ring Kluson. Late 1964-1968: Double line, double ring Kluson 1969 -1980: Double line, double ring “Gibson Deluxe”. Same tuner as Kluson Deluxe but the text reads Gibson Deluxe.

But wait. It isn’t quite that simple. The SLSR (single line single ring) Klusons in 58 are different from the ones in 59 and early 60 and this is where a lot of misconceptions arise. In most of 58, the tuner says PAT APPLD on the side of the plate that goes against the headstock when installed. These have a large oil hole and tips that tend to stay intact, that is they don’t shrink or turn to dust like so many later ones do. At around the time that they started putting the patent number on the plate “D169400”, they also changed the formulation of the plastic in the tips. This occurred over a period of months, I suspect, at the end of 1958. If your 58 has shrunken tips, check the size of the oil hole. If it’s small, the tuners aren’t original. If it has a patent number, your 58 should be a very late one. Tuners get changed so often that you’re more likely to get correct tuners than original tuners or so it seems. The small oil hole really doesn’t show up until early 60. The tips still shrink however. In fact, they didn’t change the tip plastic formulation again until around 1965. While I don’t see as many double ring (mid 60 and later) Klusons with shrunken tips, I see enough to figure the plastic is the same as a 59.

Same tuner, different text. “Gibson Deluxe” began showing up in 69, although you can find 69’s with the Kluson Deluxe designation as well. Transitions never occurred overnight. Gold 345 tuners always had single rings.

ES-345’s follow a somewhat different timeline but the situation with the tips is pretty much the same. The big difference is that they never used double ring tips on 345’s. I’ve seen a few but I’m guessing they had their tips changed. There are no 58 345’s, so we start in 59. The 345 was discontinued in 1983. Here’s the timeline:

1959-1964: Single line single ring gold. Big oil hole in 59 and much of 60. Small oil hole after that. Tips that deteriorate right up to 65. 1965-1969: Double line Kluson Deluxe single ring gold. 1969-1980: Gibson Deluxe double line, single ring gold.

Finally, we get to the ES-355 which is the easiest of all to understand. 1959-late 1963: Gold factory Grover Rotomatics marked PAT PEND. Late 1963-1982: Gold Kluson “wafflebacks” with metal buttons. No oil holes in wafflebacks or Grovers.

ES-355’s from 58-late 63 had “Pat Pend” Grovers. I don’t have a set of gold ones at the moment but the chrome one in the photo shows the Pat Pend designation. It can be in a heavy deep font like this or much lighter. On the right is a gold Kluson waffleback. These were used on 355’s from late 63 until the 355 was discontinued in 1980.

It is worth noting that tuners are the most frequently changed part on 335’s and 345’s. This is mostly because so many Gibsons had nut slots that were cut too small and the strings would bind in the nut slot if you did a lot of string bending. We all thought it was the tuners-Klusons were generally regarded as inferior in the 60’s and many of us who played these guitars back in the day (like me) switched to Grovers. It didn’t fix the problem but the damage was done and we eventually figured out that a little graphite in the nut slot was all we needed. By the 80’s, folks were still doing it but Schallers were the tuner of choice. Folks are probably still doing it to their new guitars. It’s also worth noting that guitar players are notorious tinkers. We will tweak and adjust and swap out parts in the hope of finally getting the tone that’s in our heads. I figured out long ago that the tone comes mostly from your hands.

Parts Timeline #1: Pickups

May 25th, 2020 • ES 335, ES 345, ES 355, Gibson General6 Comments »

Nice clean set of unmolested PAFs. Note how clean the solder is and how perfectly straight the edges of the cover are. Unmolested pickups will usually have no flux around the solder and the solder will be duller than new solder would be

It can be hard to tell the orange poly windings from the purple enamel coated ones in a flash photo but these are the purple ones-more brown really. The red ones are very coppery looking. This would be a PAF or an early patent number. A short magnet PAF and an early patent are identical except for the sticker.

I’m constantly searching for parts on the internet and I’m generally appalled at the descriptions some sellers write. It’s not that they describe the parts incorrectly, it’s that so many folks use the “wishful thinking” approach to dating them. My knowledge of ES guitars and their parts comes from only one source and that source is simple observation. I read everything I could find but most of what I found was full of errors. In fact the thing that started me on my ES-335 web site was a glaring error on what was (and to an extent still is) the best place to go to learn about vintage guitars. That site states: 1968 Gibson ES-335 guitar specs: Neck size increases back to 1 11/16″ with a decently size back shape. It didn’t. If the premiere vintage guitar site has that wrong, what other misinformation is out there? Plenty.

Printed information is very useful but if your observations don’t back it up, it usefulness becomes suspect. OK, enough explanation. What do folks get wrong? Let’s start with pickups. I’ve owned somewhere in the neighborhood of 50 1964 ES-335’s and probably at least 25 ’65’s. I don’t open pickups if they are factory sealed but I do open them if they have been opened in the past-if only to clean up the solder. I have never seen a T-top in a 65, let alone a 63. I’ve also never seen a poly wound pre T pickup earlier than 65. And yet, I read in ads for poly wound pre T-tops that they were in use from 63 until 65. They were not. I have a 69 in stock right now that has pre T-tops. I’ve never seen a poly winding patent number with a nickel cover unless it’s been messed with.

My experience tells me that nickel PAFs ended in 64 and they are rare in 64. Most 64’s have early enamel wound patents and none (that I’ve found) have poly windings or the black and white leads. I hear of gold PAFs showing up as late as 67. I suppose that’s possible-my experience with 67’s is limited. I’ve never seen one after 65. The earliest T-top I’ve ever found was in a 66. The latest pre t-top was in a 69 although they could have even shown up in 70. So, there is clearly quite a lot of overlap. The non gold pickup timeline as I see it is: Long magnet PAF 58-early 61. Short magnet PAF 60 (overlap with long magnet)-64 (rare). Enamel patent: 62 (overlap with PAF)-65 (overlap with poly). Poly patent: 65 (overlap with enamel)-70 (overlap with T). T-top: 66-79. The gold timeline is the nearly the same but has longer overlap. PAFs after 63 are rare. Where gold differs most is the enamel wound patents. They extend well into 65 and I’ve seen a few in 66.

Part of the problem with dating parts is the fact that they can be changed without much evidence. Pickups require re-soldering when changed, so it isn’t hard to tell if a pickup has been out of a guitar. The problem is that nobody wants to pull the harness of a 335 to check. It can be a lot of work. I almost always pull the harness when I get a “new” guitar. I check the solder at the pots, I check the solder on the covers. It isn’t hard to re-solder a pickup cover and make it look original, so look at the sides of the covers…if they are bent or dented at all, they’ve been opened. Changed pickups are really common. Les Paul guys have been scavenging double whites for decades, largely out of 335’s and 175 but also out of 345’s and 355’s. They pull the covers anyway and it’s really easy to swap out a set of gold pole screws for a set of nickel ones.

  • ES 335 Pickup Timeline
  • 1958-1961 Long magnet PAF. Rare in 61
  • 1961(overlap)-1964 Short magnet PAF. Rare in 64
  • 1962-1965 (rare)-Patent number enamel (purple windings) black leads always nickel covers. Identical to short magnet PAF except for sticker
  • 1965-1969 Pre T-top poly (orange windings) black and white leads always chrome covers.
  • 1966 (overlap)-1976 T-top with sticker. Later has embossed pat no.
  • ES-345/355 Pickup Timeline
  • 1958 (355 only)-1961 Long magnet PAF.
  • 1961 (overlap)-1965 or later (rare, overlap) Short magnet PAF
  • 1962-1965 Patent number enamel (purple) windings. Identical to short magnet PAF except for sticker
  • 1965-1969 (overlap) Pre T-top poly windings
  • 1966-1976 T-top with sticker. Later has embossed pat no.

It’s called T-top because of the “T” embossed into the bobbin (duh). Supposedly, it was there to tell the winders which end was up. You can also see that the little window (square in the circle) isn’t there on a T-top.

Fun Guitars that aren’t 335’s

May 6th, 2020 • Uncategorized13 Comments »

One of the (few) upsides to Covid-19 is that I have more time to play the guitars that I have in my possession. As a dealer, I have a pretty broad selection and during the old days (pre Covid), I didn’t play them all that much because I was too busy. I played my ’59 345 and one of the 12 strings (Ricky 660 or Breedlove Classic 12). But here at OK Guitars, there are a fair number of cool guitars that, until now, I haven’t played much. Here’s a sampling:

One of my favorites is the Epiphone Wilshire with P90’s. They only made a few hundred of them from late 60-63, so they are rare. This one is sold but I have another.

What I like so much about the Wilshire is the configuration of two P90’s and a stoptail/ABR-1. Gibson made these guitars in Kalamazoo on the same assembly line as the SG’s of the day. But an SG Special has a wrap tail. In fact, the only P90 Gibson with an ABR-1 other than the Wilshire is a Les Paul (55-57 and 68 and later). So, in the early 60’s this was it. Light weight, loud and nasty (and rare). These are a true sleeper in the vintage market. You can still find them in the $4K-$8K range but look out for changed bridge and tailpiece. Those two items are worth $2000 or more alone. Folks have started scavenging these guitars for parts.

Another rare one. This is a Rickenbacker Susanna Hoffs model. This guitar has monster pickups. The two single coils are as hot as a Mosrite at 12K ohms. The humbucker at the bridge is pretty nice too.

I think the Ricky 325/350 series are pretty cool little guitars. The Lennon connection has always been a factor, being a huge Beatles fan/aficionado. But the 325/350 is a little dull to play. It’s a decent rhythm guitar but it falls short when you want to step out front and wail. Enter the Susanna Hoffs model. Even cooler looking than the Lennon with the checkerboard bindings, the SH comes alive when you plug it in. It’s aggressive in any position and will send your amp into overdrive with a twist of the volume knob. And why is that? How about single coils at 12K? The humbucker at the bridge is pretty hot as well. Yeah, the middle pickup gets in the way for some but there’s enough room to work around it. My only complaint about the Hoffs is the nut width. It’s pretty thin at around 1 9/16″. I have short stubby fingers and I kind of fall all over myself playing narrow fingerboards at the first few frets. It weighs almost nothing and, while it’s a little pricey due to the fact they only made 250 of them, the SH is a fun diversion that couldn’t be more different than what I’m used to playing.

Bet you didn’t expect this. When I was 17, I fell in love with the looks of the Ventures Mosrite and bought one. The nut was so narrow and the frets were so small that I had to change my playing style to accommodate it. But I sure looked cool playing it.

From around 1969 until 1974, I played a Mosrite Ventures Model. It was a 65 and I put a patent number humbucker in the neck and it sounded pretty great. It was not the easiest guitar to play but it sure looked good on stage (I was still gigging until 1973). The pickups in a Mosrite are way overwound (10K-12K) and these bad boys will overdrive your amp to distraction. The frets are tiny (not so great for string bends), the nut is really narrow, they don’t stay in tune very well if you hit the whammy too hard and the single tone knob can be a problem for some players, although the single volume can be a good thing, I think. With the German carve on top, it’s still one of the most distinctive and recognizable guitars of its era even though it’s essentially an upside down Strat. Not expensive unless you are after one of the early “sidejack” ones from 63.

What’s this? Some low volume Gibson solid body with humbuckers. Yes. It’s a burst. This 1960 has been in the house for a while and, even though I’m not a Les Paul guy, this guitar could turn me into one. It’s heavier than my 345 by a pound or so and the neck is a little thinner but it’s a wonderful guitar to play. It looks pretty good too even though the red seems to have disappeared from the finish.

The first time I ever saw a Les Paul was while watching one of the mid 60’s after school programs-it was either “Shindig” or “Hullabaloo” or maybe “Where the Action is”. These programs ran from around 65 until 67 on network TV. The show that day featured the Lovin’ Spoonful and there was Zally with his Guild Thunderbird (also a fun guitar but I just sold mine) but Sebastian was playing a little solid body that I had never seen before. It looked really little and kind of funny (and it was black and white TV so the color and top weren’t much of a factor). Most folks first experience with a burst was Bloomfield, Clapton or Page but this was 1965 and those guys hadn’t really emerged to the mainstream yet with their LPs. I don’t think I have to describe what these sound like or play like. There is hardly a guitar on earth that has had more written about it. I have little to add other than they seem kind of pricey compared to a good vintage 335. Or maybe the vintage 335’s are undervalued. Hmm.

To Tank or not to Tank

April 24th, 2020 • Uncategorized3 Comments »

This photo is not totally relevant to the content but it’s such a cool picture, I thought I would show it again. I don’t think the guitars in this photo will go down in value.

Every year, in January, I write a year end post giving you my take on the market over the past year. Telling you where the market has been is easy. telling you where it’s going is something I’ve avoided and with good reason. Nobody can predict the future. If I had a crystal ball, I’d probably be living on a beach on my private island somewhere warm. I do not. So, in these difficult times, why would I go out on a limb and predict where the vintage guitar market is going? Because you asked. I’ve had a lot of emails and phone calls over the past month or so and that seems to be the compelling question. The economy is on hold. Is the market going to tank? I never took an economics course. I never took a business course. I don’t know Keynes from Fibonacci. I’m going to hypothesize based on what I do for a living.

I don’t know. That’s the simple answer, so take everything that follows as simple logic from the inside. I’m selling a lot of guitars. I dropped some prices-not so much because I think the market is in trouble but because I have no room for the gear. I moved out of my shop last month because my lease wasn’t renewed and I have to put my inventory somewhere. I will say that the current social distancing and the resultant diminished economy is going to be with us for a while yet. I don’t expect to open a new retail space for months going forward. But most of my business has always been online and that appears pretty healthy.

There are at least two important factors driving the current guitar market. One, folks are stuck at home with nothing to do and, for the guitar obsessed (like me), searching the internet for a “new” guitar is a fun, time consuming activity. (So are jigsaw puzzles but c’mon, what would you rather get delivered to your house?) Two, a lot of folks are out of work but even with that, the unemployment rate is “only” at 10%. Not a good recipe for a robust market but not lethal blow either. There will be folks who have to sell one or more of their guitars in order to meet their financial obligations (and to eat). But, I think that, in general, these aren’t the folks who were buying vintage and collector grade stuff in the first place. I believe the collector grade guitars will remain strong but will likely level off somewhat during the next few months. There will likely be some guitars hitting the market put there by sellers who really need to generate some cash. But they won’t list them at bargain basement prices. That’s human nature. This market is not one to tank over night. Look at 2008.

2008 is not the same as now; in many ways, it was worse. Yes, unemployment is worse now but long term prospects are better. But even as the economy tanked, the stock market sank and the housing market sagged, the guitar market held on for quite a few months before it started a relatively slow decline. That decline lasted a very long time and eventually took as much as 40% off the market but in 2008, that market was a bubble. The market today is the result of a slow, steady rise that, in many cases, still hasn’t reached 2008 levels.

I could go on for pages but I think I’ll just lay out my thoughts. The player market will, I think, drop. Possibly significantly. The high end market will level off. Because so many guitars are currently priced way ahead of the market (read as “overpriced”), the folks who need to sell will eventually cut prices probably down to where they should be. The one great truth in this business is that everybody (yes, everybody) thinks their guitar is worth more than it is. Does sitting on the market for months or even years deter those sellers? Nope. Not until they need to sell (for any reason-not just starvation).

So, if my opinion means anything, don’t worry about your guitars. Play them. If you’re in the market to buy, make offers that are fair and reasonable. If I’m wrong and the market tanks, you can tell me I’m an idiot but go back to paragraph two. Sentence one. That tells you everything you need to know.

This is our dog, Zoubi. She doesn’t know there’s a pandemic out there. She just knows I’m home all the time and that means more treats for doggies.

Things to Do (During a Pandemic)

April 6th, 2020 • Uncategorized3 Comments »

Watch some old episodes of “Shindig” or “Hullabaloo” from the mid 60’s. Why aren’t the Hermits’ guitars plugged in? Because there aren’t any amps…it was all lip synched).

Well, this is week number 4 that I’ve been conscientiously social distancing. A few trips to my shop to finish clearing out before my lease expires at the end of the month and one big trip to the local Stop and Shop for groceries and that’s about the extent of my travels. Binge watched “Ozark” and “Unorthodox” and am working on the Aussie quasi soap opera “A Place Called Home”. Oh, and there are guitars here. What to do.

Play. Just sit down and don’t just noodle the stuff you always play. Go to You Tube and learn a new song. Download some blues jams and try to break out of your old habits (I really need to do this). Or just practice your scales and picking. Learn to finger pick if you don’t already do it. Learn alternate tunings (which I’ve never really done other than drop D). For me, I’ve never been able to master any Steely Dan, so I’m going to try to learn a few of my old favorites. My up/down picking can always use a little more practice (I’ve got 55 years of bad habits-I only took lessons for 6 months when I was 11). You a blues player? Play some Bluegrass. A rocker? Learn some country licks. Put aside some time every day to play. I’m lucky to have a space where I can play and not wake anybody up. Play loud-just for fun. If you play sitting down, stand up. If you play standing, sit down. Mix it up. Play along with a favorite song and imagine you’re a rock star. You know you want to-even old guys like me never lose the dream.

Social Media. Post some of your favorite guitars on social media. Sharing your gear with others is a good way to make some new friends. OK, there’s a few douchebags out there who will tell you that your 66 is really a 69 or that the neck pickup looks like a t-top but mostly, everybody is nice. Go to You Tube and look for old footage of your favorite band from your favorite decade. I spent a couple hours watching old “Shindig”, “Hullabaloo” and “Where the Action Is” episodes. For anybody under 60, those were after school American Bandstand type programming with go-go dancers and big pop stars mostly lip synching their hits in black and white (man, I feel old). They aired from around mid 64 until late 66 or early 67. Watch some music documentaries. Ron Howard’s “Eight Days a Week” is wonderful. “The Wrecking Crew” is worth watching as well and there are lots of others.

Maintenance. Change your strings for crying out loud. What’s it been, six months? A year? And oil the fingerboard while you’re at it. Your guitar will thank you. Lube the tuners-nobody ever does this and spray the pots with some De-ox-it. How about you go and clean some of the gunk off your guitars as well. If you’re a gigging musician, you aren’t gigging at the moment and you’ve sweated all over your guitar for long enough. Virtuoso Cleaner is a good product. I’m sure you can order it online. Just let the box sit in the garage for a day or two or open it with your gloves on. This virus knows where you live and will wait you out.

Finally, go and buy yourself a “new” guitar or amp. You know it and I know that nothing makes you feel better than a new piece of gear. I’ve sold an astonishing number of vintage guitars and amps in the last few weeks and while everyone seems to be crying gloom and doom for the vintage market, some folks are taking advantage of that by making offers and getting some deals. A new amp will make you happy and not cost you an arm and probably both legs. I just bought a 70 Marshall JMP 50 because my 55 Twin wasn’t loud enough. Can’t afford vintage? I also bought a 3 Monkeys “Virgil” (best boutique amp out there). Or get an old Supro. A few hundred bucks for a whole new experience.

There’s lots to do at home. Just stay there until this is over. Somebody’s life depends on it. Maybe even yours.

Bored after a few weeks of social distancing? Buy yourself some “new” gear. Here’s a 69 335 in factory black. It will make you feel much better about being cooped up in your tiny apartment or your manor house.